Deiloche
2008-06-04 |  | Maru Upkeep Fixing (NOT viral) |  |
First thing to say, this is NOT a thread about virals, so do NOT mention virals at all in this thread. This is about making the marauder race less spammy and less ZOMG PYTH ANGEL. It has absolutely nothing to do with virals.
By and large, the marauder upkeep ratios are fairly random. It actually sometimes seems that the better the ship (excepting destroyers) the lower it`s upkeep, which is absolutely absurd. Now that Maraudian has easy access to changing ships, many changes to rebalance the game will follow.
The point of this thread is to address the marauder ship upkeeps. Later, once the general upkeeps are taken care of, the smaller ships of most races will receive bonuses making them actually useful to use, including marauder ships.
For now, though, the general idea of this thread is this: give marauder ships a fairly standard upkeep amount. The upkeep on pyth and angels are to be dramatically increased, while the upkeep on many other ships will be dropped significantly to more reasonable levels. Mostly, the ships will have similar upkeeps.
Feel free to comment.
Ship name - Old Upkeep - New Upkeep - Percentage of Upkeep
Eel - 22 - 7 - 9.9%
Manta - 30 - 10 - 12.8%
Ray - 37 - 8 - 9.8%
Piranha - 165 - 40 - 10.6%
D.Hammerhead - 570 - 511 - 14.1%
Barracuda - 438 - 142 - 9.4%
Pike - 410 - 201 - 15.8%
Tiger - 468 - 242 - 16.2%
Shark - 345 - 234 - 11.4%
D.Bullhead - 660 - 1002 - 15.8%
Sting - 272 - 175 - 10.9%
Pyth - 750 - 3444 - 15.3%
D.Angel - 1065 - 3711 - 16.9%
Further ship modifications (specifically some mild nerfing to the overpowered ships and some buffing to the smaller and underwhelming ships) to come. |
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Maraudian
99+ day(s) ago | thought ide point out i dont have no powers , i just get someone else to edit them |
Treize
99+ day(s) ago | read the second part genghis... i swear. why can`t people just put 1 and 2 together...? |
ThEpAkIsTaNIeMpIrE
99+ day(s) ago | no upkeep is the good part about it. |
Gronoria
99+ day(s) ago | That should be done at some point indeed Ishy |
GENGHISRAHN
99+ day(s) ago | > I don`t see spamming as illegitimate. I`m sorry but what this appears to be is an effort to defang certain races. |
Treize
99+ day(s) ago | clearly you`re not understanding the point of this thread wr.. to stop spamming? |
WarRealm
99+ day(s) ago | I disagree. Look at how collectives been modified to give terrans basically no chance. The game is way more unbalanced now than its ever been. I say leave Marauder as is. Its not good how the games changes, so that theirs no strategy to stacking. Its a matter of guessing and knowing. I say, correct this issue so that the game requires more strategy instead of pure power. Everybodies talking about increasing the power of ships etc etc, but it just means that the average power rating of empires of the game will increase as well. Kind of defeats the purpose of increasing to begin with. |
Ishamael
99+ day(s) ago | im sure if the upkeep were fixed for marauder it would have no bearing on the future of virals, am i correct? there WILL be fixing of viral upkeep eventually (Hopefully...) so how will this affect anyone but marauders? |
Deiloche
99+ day(s) ago | Yeah, the pike will get used more. The pike also has a buildrate of 10k. The pyth and angel, however, will be much harder to spam. At 46k buildrate, each. |
Gronoria
99+ day(s) ago | I hate to admit it, but I think DarckKnight has a point. Lower upkeep on certain ships like the pike affect virals as well. I`m a viral on ultra and would certainly use much more pike all the time. |
{ching}
99+ day(s) ago | its cheap enough for marauders to stack as it is, some just choose not to for various reasons, I dont like this idea sorry mate. I`m guessing it would make the least played race even less appealing. The only way to stop spamming is to take away the mods that make the spammable ships so ...spammable, now there`s a discussion to have with the new powers Maraudian has. |
Deiloche
99+ day(s) ago | *nods* I`m not taking it personally, Darck. I have been expecting your point as I myself was concerned about making the pike upkeep so low, but... the hammerhead and the bullhead were just as good of ships if not better with lower upkeep than they have now. So I really don`t think lowering it by half is going to make as much of a difference to virals as the increased upkeep on the others will. |
DarckKnight
99+ day(s) ago | lol sure deil stop acting like i'm atacking you get a grip on, you've said your side, i've said mine of how i see things, simply don't agree with dropping upkeep on pikes, if it gets implemented or not, fine by me.'i'll make sure i'll just test them out =P |
Deiloche
99+ day(s) ago | Yeah, I really do, Darck. People like that will still do whatever they want ANYWAY. And wooo, big deal, now he gets 30 mill more PR of pikes... with... nothing... supporting them? Or, at least, not nearly as much. A quarter, you might say. No, your point is SLIGHTLY relevant, but only slightly. |
DarckKnight
99+ day(s) ago | ooo nice arguments deil don't get too worked out you know i'm just messing with your head =P
you want numbers go calc a certain somebody in rt(you know who) that likes to build 30 mill power of pikes each time, go see what kind of damage you can do to with half the upkeep and 60 mill power of pikes wich some "active clickers isn't that much to build, i'm talking about this kind of abuse of this ship with that upkeep, now imagine that on slower servers
still think my point has no bearing? |
Deiloche
99+ day(s) ago | Alright, you want this to be about virals? Fine then. Do the math.
Pike, buildrate, 10k, PR 1276, upkeep is now half of what it used to be, so you can build DOUBLE what you could before of pikes.
Angels, buildrate 46k, PR 23,206, upkeep is now four times what it used to be, you can now build a QUARTER of what you used to be able to.
Pyth, buildrate 46k, 22,527, upkeep is now four times what it used to be, you can now build a quarter of what you used to be able to.
So, now lets assume that at the moment that you are going to stack based on upkeep.
You want, for sake of argument, 400,000 upkeep per stack. So that is 975 pikes at 1,244,100 PR and 122 turns, 533 pyths at 12,006,891 PR and 267 turns, and 375 angels at 8,702,250 PR and 188 turns. That totals for 1,200,000 upkeep, 21,953,241 PR, and 577 turns, with the rates of 18.3 upkeep per PR, and 38,047 PR per turn.
Now take the new stats. 1990 Pikes at 2,539,240 PR and 249 turns, 116 pyths at 2,613,132 PR and 58 turns, and 107 angels at 2,483,042 PR and 54 turns. That totals to 7,635,414 PR and 361 turns, with the rates of 6.36 upkeep per PR and 21,150 PR per turn.
So excuse me, but your point has absolutely no bearing, whatsoever. Yeah, virals can build twice as many pikes, at the cost of a whole TONNE of pyth and angels, which is what you REALLY see spammed. And Pikes aren`t that tough to beat, unlike borrellies. |
DarckKnight
99+ day(s) ago | lol deil you don't get the point you cannot say this is only about marauders it simply isn't, nobody gonna read this thread and not think what this gonna do to other races involved, its simple. |
Deiloche
99+ day(s) ago | Because that sucks HARD for marauders, and this thread is about MARAUDERS, not virals. |
DarckKnight
99+ day(s) ago | so why not maintain the pike upkeep and increase the pyth and angel upkeep? why take the good with bad when you can take it all good =P |
Deiloche
99+ day(s) ago | This is about balancing MARAUDERS. There is absolutely nothing I can do about virals, and balancing MARAUDERS should not be screwed over because of virals. And yeah, sure, pikes will have half the upkeep and virals will like that. Pyths and angels will have 4x the upkeep, and they will HATE that. Take the good with the bad, darck. |
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