nerfguardngordos
2016-08-30 |  | as my name says |  |
Nerf planets and guards now
There are a few options. One is 100 k land total for anything below a c3. This is too generous. It should be 26 k per c2 cluster. Why? Because certain players have ruined the game. Its that or all gordo planets be plundered and no compensation given to those players as they are small in number if they leave so be it they would have made more players leave in the longer term due to not being able to be caught up too. To harsh you say. No one account shouldn’t be able to dominate the ranks due to gordo abuse
There should be a vote to put to 28 k per c2 or get rid of gordo planets period and any that have been gordo plundered
Also anyone who has gordo planets votes shouldn’t be counted as bias.
Next guards income if none of this is done should be decreased up to 70 percent due to the gordo abusers are mostly guards. Ships should be nerfed. Everything really nerded they are meant to be hard not easy and blame the few whose fault it is. Other races need changed but guards need done and planets ASAP like in the next month as its ridicilous as it is |
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Asmodean
99+ day(s) ago | I never painted Sib in a bad light nor was I trying to. At the moment, hes a very active and very old Guard who pounds the ranks with such impunity as befitting a Guard. Hes a good example. |
Tranq
99+ day(s) ago | maybe I should get nerfed so you can get a win from time to time. |
DarthCaedus
99+ day(s) ago | tranq one of the biggest chicken so n so in the game |
Tranq
99+ day(s) ago | dc is not pleased.
We should change the game to suit him immediately. His ideas are revolutionary and have not been talked about before.
The game started to take a turn for the worst as of two days ago, and it`s not fair. |
DarthCaedus
99+ day(s) ago | really stargaters did you read my posts 3 threes stating GET RID OF EXPLORING FOR GORDO`D EMPIRES WITH LARGE C2S. HOW IS THAT NOT A NEW IDEA. CAPITALS BECAUSE PEOPLE CANT BLOODY READ |
Stargaters
99+ day(s) ago | I feel like this whole thread is beating a dead horse.. we`ve all been here too long and talked about this too much. No one is bringing any new ideas to the table for the admins.
Guard ship build rate is too high. Even a 5-10% lowering would make a huge difference. I don`t think anyone is arguing over this.
Gordos seem OP to players who don`t want to spend the time digging, or can`t afford to pay for them. If anything, it might not be a bad idea for gordos to go the way of PCC - you can only use them on your own empire. Other than that, everyone is on equal ground when it comes to gordoing their planets. I have to admit I don`t mind the idea of exploring being dependent upon both planets and land. As the game stands, it makes some sense.
I agree with those saying it isn`t specifically a guard issue, and singling out Sib in this context is just childish. Plenty of RT players gordoed their planets to an extreme degree, and it wasn`t just guards. As it stands, digging is the only thing left for empires with Max infra. We need more projects or something else to use turns on. If you don`t like gordos, stop complaining and start coming up with real ideas that the admins can use to further the game. |
DarthCaedus
99+ day(s) ago | and again you all miss my fair suggestion. take away exploring for any empire that gordos their planets because they can explore for borders on a 150 k c2? no? thats not fair to make them have to fight for planets instead of being safe explore 3 planets come out |
Asmodean
99+ day(s) ago | I agree with Sib. Time put into an empire should yield some long term benefit good enough to keep that player interested and competitive.
As far as upkeep for ships go, this message:
"The Guardian race has no need of food !"
That alone makes upkeep costs relevant again. And as I posted earlier, tax income is THE only viable income now, and entirely dependent on land. Now we come to gordoes.
For a Guard, 49k land nets you 2.2mil per turn roughly. Im not going to be too specific. That keeps you explorable assuming youre not acting like a mineral miner. And, if you spend alot of time on the game, you can clear 5bil credits a day digging.
That will take you a long time to gain serious fighting cash. 100bil wont go very far, even for a guard so what do you do when you cant buy food? It is a recent change but now you see how this turns out.
In the old days, Guards played the food market. Thats how some gained cash fairly quickly. Most gordo. Gordoing for a Guard has the benefit of remaining explorable and not having to remain active all day every day to gain cash quickly. You can do the same in less time with more land.
Now 500k is absurd. I will admit I am not opposed to a land cap, nor one that makes it harder to explore, so long as the cap keeps exploring reasonably effective. Meaning 30 turns a planet using 2700 scouts...pure example only.
Its all about the balance. Yall out there complaining that guards are too rich and gordo too much.. well, thats true in a way but Guards no longer have the option to buy food. Massive land is the only way now to be competitive. It cannot be done quickly without investing alot of time and money.
Finally, any race you play, if some folks have more money to spend on GC than others and actually spend it, there will always be an unbalancing effect when the non money spenders cant gordo as fast... maybe focus on that and not pee on us guards ^^ |
Sibiriangun
99+ day(s) ago | Lol EP a 100k land cap :-)
You seem to forget that you can have more land with larges. Making a gordoed empire takes time... Or for some people cash... so spending the time on gordos or exploring larges should be the same right? That`s why staff said 150k which makes sense.
And imo there SHOULD be a benefit for putting time into your empire... Otherwise people would quit the game much more often. Everyone can make a competitive mineral miner in a week or less so I think it`s fair that those who put in the time and effort to make an empire that suits their play style gets a fair chance too.
And PLEASE go ahead and make a 500k c3... Be my guest! |
Tranq
99+ day(s) ago | There`s been a fundamental imbalance since the guard ships got revamped. This is basic math. They build faster, have better shields, more survivability, and attacking on careful is the only attack style where the attacker isn`t penalized offensively. So range disadvantage goes out the window when they`re on the offensive and playing to their cards.
That being said, their income isn`t a problem. It`s a little frustrating that they`re useless on the market mostly. Kinda kills an aspect of the game I wish was more active.
Gordos have had the potential to be `abused` so to speak since their inception, and I`ve made that point since they were introduced. The issue now is that they`ve been around long enough that people would want some sort of compensation which is understandable.
So yeah, there`s some issues at play. But they`ve been there for so long, you`d be wasting your time expecting any quick fixes.
If you can`t beat them, join them. Or you can stick to your principles and not play guard or use Gordos. The power is yours! |
Maverick
99+ day(s) ago | Honestly, if you wanted to gordo to 500k with your terran as TBK has done then do it. He has easily taken the ranks just as much as any other heavily gordoed empire. To be honest and fair to those who have spent years working on their own empire, taking away exploration is a punishment to their hard work and honestly as BW has stated hes looking into some ceiling on land total I believe it was 150k land (for those that are exploreable) as they would get hit with upkeep changes and income changes I believe.
Lastly, which is something that has been failed to mention is the economies of scale, a guardian does have cheap upkeep, but what an a. miner can make in a day would take a guardian almost a week (granted depends on the type), but I can compare to a tax miner better where they can make 100 mil p/t and me only making 2 mil p/t. So, really we are arguing against guards about land and not about their economy as part of the equation.
Lastly, miners can defeat guards, however as I have stated in past ship balance posts is that miners are weak missile wise even with e. ships compared to other races, but that has fallen on death ears. |
Vslice
99+ day(s) ago | I dont see how having a 100k land c2 correlates to an empire being op and controlling the ranks. so what, they can make money twice as fast as they could with 50k land.
now ship build rates on the other hand. |
DarthCaedus
99+ day(s) ago | and take a honest question before my last long post gets missed. do you think it would bring more balance to the game if empires with huge gordo`d c2s of ANY race should have explore taken away as if someone has c3s with 100 k land without gordo`d they can lose them and cant explore for borders like people with 100 k c2 |
DarthCaedus
99+ day(s) ago | and take a honest question before my last long post gets missed. do you think it would bring more balance to the game if empires with huge gordo`d c2s of ANY race should have explore taken away as if someone has c3s with 100 k land without gordo`d they can lose them and cant explore for borders like people with 100 k c2 |
DarthCaedus
99+ day(s) ago | il repost this to people who missed it. o? it unbalances the game. it is unfair players with huge land based on gordoing have the ability to explore for borders and just keep a c2 at 100k. take away exploring from people who gordo one c2 and not build higher. that would make things a little more balanced. and that goes for any race Terran or guard or whoever. How would you guys feel if i wiped out my bank account paid a grand to get 100 k land c2 in a day. then make another 2 exploring then do what I have done already fight to make a c3 of 150 k lets say. then spend more of that grand I have on making a c3 of 500 k land and easy peasy to hold one c3 on RT. how would you guys feel. you can say thats a waste of money etc Im not going to do it but my point being. what about if I make again another c2 and left over money of that grand make it as big as hell and make another c3 etc 2 c3s of 500 k land or more. it sounds ridiculous and it is as there`s no way I will spend a grand on any game but I know people who can and have.
and sib as stated by badwolf. build rates for all races can now be adapted for each server which was cried down by certain players by saying it take to much effort. Its up to the admins to decide if its too much time its their lives. it would balance TB servers more to have various races different slighty and make it more strategy to play TB servers as a guard or collective. I dont think Guard ships are overpowered. Terran and viral can beat them up good. Miner cant. miner ships werent intended to be offensive though. |
TheSphere
99+ day(s) ago | Mompys idea is really bad. Nerf mompy. Plz. |
Helms{}Deep
99+ day(s) ago | I tend to agree with what mompy, Ren and Sibi have said- it isn`t a Guardian thing. As for Sibi being able to climb up and hulk smash everyone down, that is great timing on his part, and had to do largely that some of us need sleep and happen to be sleeping when he can play. He has built his empire to he can sustain high PR fighting, so kudos to him and anyone else that can do it. What I find more funny is the lack of experience that some people exhibit when dealing with Guardians, namely they try to win defensively on a Guard. You need to take the fight to a Guard, as the below comments have shown. And then the good question mompy asks- is your empire set up correctly? |
Sibiriangun
99+ day(s) ago | EP I agree with you about the gordo issue. It wasnt the intention that explorable empires should have 200k land, but that is NOT a guard thing! Just many guards have gone this way, since being tax with a huge base PR is kind of hard for unexplorable empires. There are plenty of big ferts around out there too, but they dont give a 5mil base.
I still urge you to do the math with break even PR for any race with 200k land (think BW/EE did it at some point, but cant find the post), im sure guards arent the highest.
As Ren said, guard ships arent OP when looking at their stats (yeah tourm is) and it is so easy to kill guards on aggro due to low range and missile weakness of their ships. The one thing that works for guards is their versatile shiplist all with high range, so you can chose to spam 5-6 different ships fast compared to 2-3 ships for other races.
But I think you should try playing guard on a TB server to see how easy it is to get a rank controlling guard there for yourself.
To sum up: Gordos are broken, guard ships arent. Their buildrate could be cut a bit for some like quartz/emmy but that would affect TB servers as well where it really is hard (or takes time at least) to make a potent guard empire. |
Renegade
99+ day(s) ago | The thing with guards is sure, I think their ships could use a bit of tweaking to make them slightly more prone to stacking rather than spamming, but they are not terribly OP.
Tbh mompy has a good point - Using Sib as an example sure he can build 1 ship and careful spam down a large portion of the ranks, but that`s a time zone thing more than a guardian thing. If someone is online, guardians are rather weak defensively. It would be easy to aggro hit said spam with most anything else and clear most of it.
If this doesn`t make sense I`m drunk and on vacation,. Forgive me. |
mompyuser
99+ day(s) ago | An couple of facts:
Like in real wars there is no option to go to mammy and cry on her brest and say: mum i have an rifle with 700 meter range and the enemy has 800 meter range so i cant win fights.
Ya need to addapt to that stuff.
Peeps also seem to forget this is still an wargame!! So if ya loose an fight dont go runnin to mum.
High pr fights have everything to do with how the empire is set up. If ya cant fight high prs then your setup is not good.
Sib or raist trollin the ranks means they have an good empire setup. They can go high prs and prolly have either an C2 or somethin else beefed up or maybe stole some stuff from another empire.
As an empire ya can choose to stay explorable. Like me. Why? Cause its verry time consumin when ya hoard planets and have to fight for boarders. Some of us do have an real life aswell.
As for nerfin gaurds i think that its not neccesary. Its verry hard to have an good income. I speak now for ma self but i never lost more defensive fights as i do now then with any other race ive played. As viral or collective my defencive win rate was much higher then now with the gaurd race.
Maybe im still in an learning fase :)
Then bout Sib trollin the ranks. Most of us know Sib can fight an bit . He killed an couple of ma UW attempts with serious blows. I mean once he sniffs out your stack of ships he knows what to built.
But hey i know here like 20 guys that can do that but they arent that active any more.
And i think that most of the good guys that arent active anymore lost intrest in the game cause the game dont evolve. Seriously collectives and virals stil no missions? If ya have an app on your phone ya get regular updates. Regular here is every decade.
I saw many empires camping in the hundred millions pr in my days. Virrals miners gaurds and some marus. So whats stoppin you with 277 planets.
Is YOUR empire set up right???? |
