{DrKsT}GuArDiAn
2012-11-10 |  | Guard Balancing |  |
This thread was originally being pushed by some staff members then was closed due to the server not wanting to drastically change up K.class. I was sitting up late last night thinking about the advantages Guard has over the other races and I came up with some balancing ideas that I think are solid and require no hard coding.
#1 Guard can explore so I would remove the G. Diamond all together or in the very least redesign it on a much smaller build rate. With gordos it makes it way op for a guard to climb in dp to 100 mill in an hour. Im in favor of dropping it all together making guard more challenging.
#2 Three k.class is too much, remove Hun Xe or give the player a choice between Zen or xe if hes paid but not both.
#3 Redesign Corrundom to be long range, no retal and pure kinetic. I have submited tested designs in the past that were tested and it took a long time to do it. |
|
{DrKsT}GuArDiAn
99+ day(s) ago | It would appear BW is speechless. |
BadWolf
Game-Admin
99+ day(s) ago | |
Squaks
99+ day(s) ago | seems to me some income changes are needed along with a guard ship revision to k class and such.... nerf a miner and buff virals/maru |
Renegade
Game-Admin
99+ day(s) ago | DM, I am most certainly saying that, Virals have roughly the worst economy in the game on most every server. And frankly you`re just plain silly if you think otherwise. |
{DrKsT}GuArDiAn
99+ day(s) ago | Their are lots of Guards because the race is no longer considered a hard race to play. You dont have to be a master stacker to realize "hey I can spam twice as fast as you" . Not many players play 10 hrs a day anymore like the old days so they get themselves a safe race thats explorable and bot up while doing something else more fun. Guard was meant to be a hard race to play and ut was a lot more of a challenge during the pre update days. The guards of old who were successful then can hold their heads high.
Guard is an easy race now if you understand the basic fundamentals of stacking and battle mechanics. I urge the staff and implore them to consider the following:
Remove g.diamond- new guards dont needed it, op guards cant live without it.
Redesign g.corrundom to be a stacking tool
Three k.class is too much- keep li, redesign xe, or xe and zen
A minor needs to be addressed as well and I feel its just as important to rebalance the game again as is addressing the rebalance for guards but thats for another topic for discussion. |
DrunkenMasters
99+ day(s) ago | Marauders have cheap ships and potentially great income. I say that because I have been one on quite a few servers quite successfully. Much bigger income than guards can even dream about, even considering the upkeep and everything. Even if the guards are smartly and patiently built. So no, guards can`t really go up that easily.
With my marauder back in the day on RT I could reach 100 mil PR daily without even loosing cash and building a nice balanced stack. That was an empire with a bit over 101 infra(120ish or something) and around 200k land. Certainly not average but definitely not unreproducable. Whilst a guard with the same infra and manageable level of land(due to the high base PR) has not been, is not and probably will never be able to reproduce such feat. And about Collectives - let`s not start this argument, but let`s just say this is RT-only problem. |
DrunkenMasters
99+ day(s) ago | Are you implying that guards have better economy than virals?!?!? |
Renegade
Game-Admin
99+ day(s) ago | Valid issue in that we cannot only affect RT without affecting turn-based. Regardless I still think guards are incredibly powerful on turn-based, and a re-design wouldn`t have much of a negative impact on them there.
The thing I think all of you who are saying guards aren`t OP are missing is that there is little reason to go other races if your goal is to be a powerful empire.
It`s not just the gordo`d old guards who can do tons of damage, look at Squaks, GM, Balzac. These guys aren`t hugely old or with giant gordo`s planets, and they can have an incredible effect on the servers standings.
There is small reason to go Collective or Marauder atm, due to the lack of targets, roughly no reason to go Viral due to having possibly the worst economy in the game right now, and many of the ships that made them overpowered removed. Terrans are balanced, but why bother playing one when you can go Guardian, and do tons of damage with just a bit of cash saved up, or A Miner, where you can make massive amounts of money and do as you please with relatively little effort? |
Squaks
99+ day(s) ago | There were a lot of guards way before darkst started that fed btw, We had this discussion a few months ago and i mentioned that there is a lot of guards now compared to before. |
GalacticMercenaries
99+ day(s) ago | Squaks Reason theres more guards is because Darkst Made an all guard fed and we have all been getting people to go guard old players and new not because the race is over powered |
Cattleya
99+ day(s) ago | that`s the way aha aha we like it aha aha...Drks, bring it on! *moonwalks then dives. |
DrunkenMasters
99+ day(s) ago | This is of course opinion of a person playing TB. Not everybody has 10 hours per day every day to dig day after day, year after year and combine that with hundreds of dollars to get a pimped c2 and after that to claim the race is overpowered. You can claim every race is overpowered that way.
E.g. major gordo your homeworld as a tax miner. How overpowered is that? You can`t die, you can`t lose colonies. And huge income. |
DrunkenMasters
99+ day(s) ago | This is not balancing, EE, this is tweaking the mods/BRates/ships as per peoples`/admins`/guides` requests/visions. If it was balancing, it was going to be done years ago with the first `balancing`. Everytime a `balancing` is done, I see people leave this game, and no people come to replace them.
Sorry for being sour about that, but in my 6+ year experience in this game, I have seen it gradually lose ground from 200+ people online at all times to 30-40. Everybody is pointing Stephen for that, but we should take some responsibility ourselves.
In my honest opinion, the guardian race was designed to fight UWs mainly(correct me if I am wrong). If you change the mods of the K class ships even by 5 percent, it will have extreme effect on the UWs. Believe me. As when the shields get higher the damage done to the ship drops exponentially. And that being said, imagine for instance Galleon spam UW. What will you fight that with?
There were many pressing issues in this game before, I think most of these have been addressed pretty well by the staff and I generally think the game is in pretty stable state at the moment.
Sure, K class ships can be redesigned, but in my opinion there should be at least one ship left with these mods, just for the sake of the purpose of guardians. |
Africa
99+ day(s) ago | What makes guardians OP is gordos. I used to play Guardian back a long time ago and I think I was a decent guard as well. I didnt use gordos and I was able to climb often enough with my c2 and larges, but nothing like guards of today. I guess that was also before the build rate reduction of the angel from 3 to 2. (and the remake of guard ships which Ive never liked!!)
That made a big change..lol.
The eternal problem will always be balance between the diff servers. If you nerf guards cause the are too strong on rt they are gonna suffer twice that nerf on turnbased. Especially if the hold planets like DM on fast.
I dont know what to do about the fact that the gordoed fertiles or whatever are out there. But without those planets guardians would prolly be just fine. |
{DrKsT}GuArDiAn
99+ day(s) ago | *Starts doing the robot to Led Zeplin* |
EphemeralEternity
99+ day(s) ago | yes pansy, Disco and Polka funk were both my fault, sorry |
UberPansy
99+ day(s) ago | Disco is horribly awful... EE did you make disco?
/me taps foot impatiently |
Cattleya
99+ day(s) ago | Disco time, did you see my moonwalk Drkst? Love that strobe... |
{DrKsT}GuArDiAn
99+ day(s) ago | Im always appreciative of the staffs efforts to make things better or balancing something out as long as its sole intention is to benefit the entire game. Its the one thing I can focus on when I have personel feelings against staff members. It helps me to rise up beyond selfish reasoning and try to contribute something positive. Although I have played on and off over the years I have player since 05 and I have only played ever played guard to power. Im a guard now, and I have an all guard fed with 15 daily active members so whatever happens with guard as a race has a dramatic impact on everything connected to me in this game and I only want whats best and fair for everyone playing. |
EphemeralEternity
99+ day(s) ago | aside from that, if we break something, and make something so horribly awful, we do have the power to change things back to the way the were. |
