Updates and Changes

angel > livid pretty badly -_- even on an equal PR basis...keep in mind the lower BR of livid

Livid and Sapphire are the only ships that can deal with angel and all other lame ships miner cant take XD

Trying to get back to what the discussion was originally about: Miner bases upkeep.

I really think the upkeep needs to be doubled. In that way they wont (maybe) be spammed as much in UWs and are very cheap for normal use.

You guys are like a gang of high school bullies, I`ll leave you to your fun.

No comment from now on, I am speechless. Whatever I had to say, I said it, and btw Slavyzz pretty much sumed it up maybe even better than myself.

no wai! :O

Didn`t you hear infernal? Now whenever you use nirvana your opponent receives a stack of strafez to counter it, and it now has range 0

nirvana is useless?
*shakes head and walks away*

And I didn`t even think of the sapphire, from the sims I just ran it looks like it takes care of business against galls

Any spam is easy to break through, just put enough no retal ships into a stack and hit it.

Ok lictors get owned by galleons... lictors dmg sipmply to pathetic to break through galleon spam....

Yep I agree.. The Galleon is a tough one for Miners. Only ship that does good against it is the G.Sapphire. in general I think the Gall may be a little too good - but thats just my opinion.

I don`t know about the other races but as a collective I can usually find a good answer for when I am expecting hercs.

As for miners not having anything to go up against Gall I see a lot of ships in their yard with high kinetic mods (the lictor for instance which also has a a buildrate more than twice that of gall so if a coll is spamming galls you could laugh as you hit him fro 29% without ever having to worry about him catching up). And one ship that you don`t have an easy answer to shouldn`t hinder you much. Honestly I don`t have any ships that can really pwn face on chlors so I usually set it up against something decent and try and get it flanked.

I spent a lot of time as terran on fast and it is my personal belief that the garuda build rate should be increased. But that isn`t exactly necessary, I never found myself limited in any big way by the ships I had (though I could build two hercs per turn back then).

I agree with a lot of the things that DM said but really every ship has strengths and weaknessess and every races shipyard has its ups and downs. I don`t think we will ever achieve any sort of perfect balance and probably the best we can hope for is more regular changes so that no one gets too comfortable with one thing. Maybe one race has a better arsenal but what I find most enjoyable about this game is finding the creative ways to overcome strategies rather than complain about how they are unfair.

herc > tourm/ruby/quartz//topaz/garnet/emmy/tyr/gall/bsword/sword/angel/lyth(to an extent)/thor/zeus/odin/pinnace/

that`s just from the top of my head, im sure i missed a few destroyers...just tried to include some commonly used ships here. And you can tell: that`s pretty dang good.

Miners have no ship good against the gall and I`m pretty sure they only have 1 ship that stands up to angel.

As for the tourm/pinnace/ruby/quartz kin boats...miners get ripped apart fighting them, but all terrans gotta do is have 1 stack of herc to absorb the dmg.

Ofc, miners can build fez to counter missle, but fez builds slow.

I think that terrans are pretty balanced the way they are right now. The only reason why they`re shipyard might be taken as mediocore is cuz virals can take any ship they want from terran and that terran don`t have any unique ships of their own imo. But since this discussion has nothing to do with viral....

Of course a taxer with 1 C3 is equivalent with a terran with several C3s. After all, a tax miner makes up to 7x the income of commerce terrans. However, the bigger tax miners get, their base PR just gets increasingly impossible to play. also, they will start messing up the market and reduce their profits since their consumption will drive food up. Hence....at extreme infra/land levels commerce terrans are pretty amazing because they earn a steady profit without huge base PRs.

Conclusion: terrans are pretty decent right now, depending on your playing style.

Thor and Zeus can be useful at low power on offense.
But many ships have powerful ECM shields, and on defense they will die horribly to a spammer.
Nirvanas have no range and are wiped away by strafez like a bad dream.
Weapon to power and what not only matters at lower pr where you can build as many ships as you want for the situation at hand. At high power less powerful ships with higher build rates own face (the Lyth and Lictors of the world).
Hercs are balanced to be quite beatable with their low range, relatively light weaponry, and no ability to retaliate.
Ryujins have no range at all and allow retaliation.
Garuda could be good but its horrificly laughable ECM shielding makes it a bad joke. Its weaponry is very bad for a Destroyer, and its buildrate is beyond awful.
The Empereur is a decent enough ship, at least it can be stacked.

*barges in and shouts... SELF-SUFFICIENT TERRANS ROCKS...!!! ...then hides again among the shadows...

:P

I am not saying terran has THE best shipyard, but I guess the long time you have played it make you take some ships for granted - as I said try playing other races and you will see why I point to thor and zeus and terran arsenal overall.

Mediocre shipyard? Ok, tell me 1 better missile destroyer in this game better than thor and zeus. One better energy/kinetic flagship better than nirv. One better missile flagship than tyr. Sure they may lack some attributes/damage others have, but compared one on one, nirv is probably better even than pyth. Maybe the best spamming ship in the game. Tyr has way lower build rate than lyth - but looking at its damage and damage:PR, damage : turn, tyr is WAAAY better. Thor and zeus compared to other missiles are way better. Herc is probably the best defensive ship in the game. Ryu is one of the best energy ships in this game. Garuda isn`t a bad ship at all either. What to say about odin - sure, it has very low build rate, but at low PR this ship is just as good as anything. Ok ,there are some mediocre ships like kalieum and empereur, but every race has some mediocre ships.

Read my post: despite what I feel is a mediocre shipyard/income stream (Comm) I have had success with Terran and I`ve been able to hold my own against various opponents. In short I`ve enjoyed my time as a Terran and never wanted to destroy my efforts and restart. Whether I would have found more enjoyment playing another race I cannot say, but it doesn`t really matter.

I am not saying my opinion is superior. I am saying your opinion is biased. That is different.

Just answer me one very simple question : If terran is so tremendously unbalanced, lame, with low income, sucky ships, low build rates etc, why are you still playing it after 2000 days?