Guardian Update Discussion

D DeilocheOP

OP 15/07/2009 · 08:25 AM #1

Constructive criticism ONLY. If you don`t like something, say why. If you do like something, please also say why. Useless posts are unacceptable.

Changes courtesy of: EphemeralEternity, BrokenSwordS, Deiloche, Raistilin

G.Fluorite
E: 8,000 > 30,000
K: 8,000 > 0
Hull: 180,000 > 180,000
R: 6 > 4
Scanner: 4,200 > 500
Upkeep: 9,000 > 7,500
PR: 73,827 > 69,768
BR: 1 > 1
ES: 99 > 40
KS: -30 > -60
MS: -20 > 20
CS: -20 > 25

Tourmaline
K: 8,000 > 1,500
Hull: 15,000 > 18,000
R: 4 > 4
No Retal > No Retal
Scanner: 250 > 1,400
Upkeep: 720 > 700
PR: 6,510 > 6,510
BR: 4 > 5
ES: -50 > 25
KS: 50 > -60
MS: -40 > 50
CS: 40 > -20

G.Amethyst
E: 4,000 > 15,000
K: 4,000 > 0
Hull: 40,000 > 24,000
R: 4 > 6
Scanner: 3,500 > 1,800
Upkeep: 2,100 > 2,030
PR: 21,132 > 18,018
BR: 3 > 2
ES: 99 > 0
KS: -20 > 50
MS: -20 > -65
CS: -20 > -0

L.Topaz
M: 29,500 > 16,000
Hull: 25,000 > 100,000
R: 8 > 7
No Retal > No Retal
No Defense > No Defense
Scanner: 3,400 > 2,700
Upkeep: 4,536 > 5,091
PR: 47,511 > 49,081
BR: 1 > 1
ES: -45 > 35
KS: 10 > -20
MS: 90 > 95
CS: -55 > -45

L.Garnet
M: 16,000 > 8,000
Hull: 40,000 > 20,000
R: 7 > 8
No Retal > No Retal
No Defense > No Defense
Scanner: 5,000 > 2,050
Upkeep: 3,600 > 1,834
PR: 35,728 > 16,303
BR: 2 > 3
ES: -20 > 0
KS: -10 > -15
MS: 50 > 25
CS: -10 > 10

Edited by BrokenSwordS on 2009-07-16

S Squaks

23/07/2009 · 08:23 AM #77

thats because no one really uses energy ships vs guard very often so having 99% resist to energy can be rather useless

K Karnage

23/07/2009 · 07:27 AM #76

yea i know, but K class is KalZul, a Guardian ship hence the "G"
but either way its just something to discuss...just happened to think about that.

A Archaeoptyrex

23/07/2009 · 07:21 AM #75

i think we`re ignoring story -- K class still ene immune

K Karnage

23/07/2009 · 06:21 AM #74

G.Fluorite
E: 8,000 > 30,000
K: 8,000 > 0
Hull: 180,000 > 180,000
R: 6 > 4
Scanner: 4,200 > 500
Upkeep: 9,000 > 7,500
PR: 73,827 > 69,768
BR: 1 > 1
ES: 99 > 40 ?? reduction of 59
KS: -30 > -60
MS: -20 > 20
CS: -20 > 25
--------------------------------
G.Amethyst
E: 4,000 > 15,000
K: 4,000 > 0
Hull: 40,000 > 24,000
R: 4 > 6
Scanner: 3,500 > 1,800
Upkeep: 2,100 > 2,030
PR: 21,132 > 18,018
BR: 3 > 2
ES: 99 > 0 ?? reduction of 99 - guardian ship with no energy shield hmmm interesting eh?
KS: -20 > 50
MS: -20 > -65
CS: -20 > -0

K Karnage

23/07/2009 · 06:18 AM #73

"The Guardians being composed of energy do not consume food. They however excel in the field of energy research producing one of the best energy shields in the known galaxy. This advantage makes most energy-based weapons ineffective against them. Unable to attain the pleasures of consuming food, the Guardian race takes pleasure in collecting consumer goods from other races.

Special ability
Effective energy shield"

why is it suggested that the energy shield for the most part is reduced?

A archaeoptyrex

22/07/2009 · 09:30 PM #72

if you`re worried about the build rate, just multiply by 2/3 or 3/4 ... at 45-55k build, fluorite will still be a good ship

D DeilocheOP

22/07/2009 · 04:58 PM #71

"Every other race" does not have a ship that moves at 70k PR per turn.

S Squaks

21/07/2009 · 04:58 PM #70

whats wrong with giving us a spamming ship every other race does

D DeilocheOP

21/07/2009 · 03:22 PM #69

collective1, if you have nothing useful to say, please stop posting.

And yeah, I am a bit worried about the fluorite and it`s potential for spamming.

C collective1

21/07/2009 · 12:48 PM #68

uhoh look like a strong megachlor but galleo will still kill it lol

M MastaKilla

21/07/2009 · 03:30 AM #67

I think it looks good in general, but the Fluorite seems to be very spammable. Before the ship updates several guards on Fast (i only play there) often used huge Corr spams on careful, and with all that hull and decent damage I think the proposed Fluorite can be used in the same way. Maybe slightly more damage to tourm but otherwise good job!

K Knossos

18/07/2009 · 10:10 PM #66

That`s what I took from your former posts also deli and I do actually prefer the overall changes made thus far. The topaz/emmy still maintained their missile sheilds so naturally that`s what I expected. Thank-you for taking the time to comment on my posts.

D DeilocheOP

18/07/2009 · 07:51 PM #65

Nice to hear Arch. Any specific comments on how people think any of these ships ought to be changed? We won`t, by the way, listen to anybody who wants us to return the tourmaline to it`s former glory. If you have a well reasoned reason for why it needs a small upgrade (and it had better be small, because the thing is still pretty useful) then argue the point. Personally, I love the new version of it, especially with the increased buildrate, making it easier to incorporate into a stack.

A Archaeoptyrex

18/07/2009 · 07:25 PM #64

nice amethyst, nice garnet

good job

D DeilocheOP

18/07/2009 · 06:17 PM #63

Exactly. Just like the G.Class characteristic was 99% energy shielding. You may have noticed, that has changed too.

Stephen made this game poorly. It seriously lacked balance and niche ships. I`m an avid StarCraft fan. I cannot give EVERY ship it`s own, unique role, but I am going to freaking well try to give every ship a niche in which it fits. Some ships will have the role of tanks, some offensive powerhouses. Some will be mainstays of fleets, some will be made not as backbones but as utility ships with very specific uses. Take the observer from StarCraft. Not exactly a powerful ship, but if the enemy is using certain units and you don`t have some, you`re in trouble. That`s what I`m going for here. Everything has it`s place.

K Knossos

18/07/2009 · 02:43 PM #62

Just seemed like a L class characteristic to me, that`s all.

D DeilocheOP

18/07/2009 · 08:58 AM #61

No, ya think? Obviously, it`s a missile ship, the chem mod has nothing to do with fez. :P The ecm mod was reduced because guards have been given plenty of anti missile ships and due to the increase in range the ship needed to be made more vulnerable.

K Knossos

18/07/2009 · 03:33 AM #60

My thinking was w/ the garnet versing queens runners ect. EIther way it`s pretty much dead. It might be slightly better vs. V class.

K Knossos

18/07/2009 · 03:21 AM #59

Everything looks pretty good. I would rather see the Garnet maintain more of it`s missile shield though. Why was it given a slight positive chemical shield when it`s already super vulnerable due to it`s strict missile arsenal?

C chaos

17/07/2009 · 11:22 PM #58

The new tourmaline is a good break from "spam-missile-ship-all-you-can" on Guard. The current situation is either they meet L. class, which they fail miserably, or easily leave some rubble behind. Capital ships with multiple damage types could even render L. class useless. Though I`d like some ship to remain to do the current tourm/previous ruby job. Maybe we could revert Ruby as it was,or a slightly weakened version.

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