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CapitalShip Build Rate Feedbac

Started by SagacityUSRR · 30/09/2007 · 11:15 AM · 39 replies · 2 reads

OP 30/09/2007 · 11:15 AM #1

So the ships have been changed a bit and there is a banner saying that feedback is wanted yet i see no thread so i thought I`d start one .... SO here it is , post up people , let your views be known,

My thoughts ... It is virtually impossible to build a quick fleet , to counter attack especially , if the person who has attacked you is able to build back up afterwards also , it basically u with no hope of exacting revenge as the other person can just sit up high and knock you down everytime u try and build up.

B BoomZilla

08/10/2007 · 01:54 PM #40

xxxx attacked you. Attack has failed !

Name Units Casualties Remaining
xxxxxx`s fleet
Pike Destroyer 6,588 0 6,588
V.Borrelly Destroyer 18,443 16,909 1,534
M.Chlorite Destroyer 6,000 5,106 894
Nirvana Dreadnought 1 1 0
M.Flysch Battleship 1 1 0
F.Sword Destroyer 1 1 0
F.Broadsword Destroyer 1 1 0
Strafez Queen 1 1 0
Large Strafez Runner 1 1 0
C.Gemini Frigate 1 1 0

well, the new nerfed builds bit me..
could have had a nice counter with quick herc/nirvs

B basian_[S]

03/10/2007 · 10:36 AM #39

ohh and not to mention, in your previous situation of climbing to meet a higher power... It is sortof obvious that you are spamming capital ships and easily countered by the opposing, knowing your race, what enemies race is, and what is the most common attack type for that combo. I have countless senarios of people climbing to hit me with herc/tyr spams only to get beaten back down, all because I knew what their stack was because of how quickly they rose to hit me.

And I forgot to address the issue of slower servers...

Again the only differance is it lowers the pr`s that you can "sneak" attack to without the use of TC`s. So again, completely mute, its is mearly reducing the working quick prs and total effective prs by increasing the cost of increasing pr.

And in an abstract way, that hits virals pretty hard considering most have selected almost all of the "good" capital ship classes, and now have inadvertingly increased their cost of raising a fleet. Although it effects other races too, but it balances out better since sometimes the best answer for a capital ship spam is a destroyer spam, a costly trade off.

B basian_[S]

03/10/2007 · 10:30 AM #38

That doesn`t make much sense Squishy...

You were limited before by the amount of pr you could build in 30 turns... and now you are limited by the pr you could build in 30 turns. And considering that a "higher" power may or may not be watching the rankings, they just might whack you as soon as you get into attack range, putting you at the disadvantage.

I guess what I am trying to say is that before the "suprise" element was based on the pr differance between you and your target (assuming that you can jump into a decent hitting position within the given timespan between your opponet checking the rankings), and how long it took you to cross that distance. All that this change has done is make that distance shorter, meaning the distance (in pr) that you can traverse without being noticed on average.

This doesn`t mean that you can`t suprise whack somone who is sitting at 10 mil pr and checking the rankings every 1 minute if at all.

I personally feel that your point is mute since only at "lower" prs of a few million can you "suprise" people, and most of the fun takes place below 4 million pr anyways =P.

S SquishyPickle

03/10/2007 · 05:30 AM #37

Sucks...cant sneak up on a higher power. Might as well wear a big red flashing light on your head saying "HERE I COME"

S starseeker

02/10/2007 · 06:16 AM #36

I play Slow and RT mostly. Most battles under 1 mil PR on slow, under 5 mil PR on RT. Only real difference is remembering to build Nirvana in factor of 2 now. Otherwise, negligible to no change at all experienced.

Collective are thoroughly intimidating. I never attack them unless I have a retal from around 10X PR.

D Deiloche

02/10/2007 · 03:44 AM #35

Collective buildrate is still fairly low, comparatively.

T theworldunited

02/10/2007 · 02:05 AM #34

completly off topic as this is the cap nerf thread............

but i still think have the dig time set up as they are is unfair as currently it means i`m only able to dig during weekends because of work and skl where someone else can dig all day as its there evening ... if u get what i mean ... o well this has been moaned about forever and yes i no its never gona change but meh thats just my 2 cent :D

S ShatterdDreams

02/10/2007 · 01:20 AM #33

boo *scolds the staff* how could you really implement such a thing, omg it`s horrid. to bad i haven`t had a chance to try out or see the new build rates in action, so keep on keeping on and do kool stuff and blaa

*continues not to care about any alterations done to any ship thus far and eats a cookie the kind that can`t be stolen no matter how hard someone tries or no matter how discriptive and factual of a why they compose to take my already ate cookie*

O Omegian

02/10/2007 · 12:56 AM #32

heh, I still will raise only one point, work on the dig times so americans dont have to wake up at 330 am to dig Maraudian. I cant move to europe or asia area where i can dig during the good times.

Heh, all they do is dig maraudian, and they know i dont and never can ... thus is a big advantage for them to use their extra artifacts to over attack my 200 turn stack versus their 500 ... when it hurts, not saying all the time.

only ste can fix it , and nothing is stopping you clicking on a planet and digging , you dont need to dig at dig times. as for me im usually still on here at 3:30am , but would have to wake up 2 hours early to catch the start of dig times but i dont run round shouting unbalanced because i neglect this area of the game while other empire dont , i just put more effort into digging , outside dig times.

Edited by Maraudian on 2007-10-03

T TheChaosKnight

01/10/2007 · 04:13 PM #31

lame....

B basian_[S]

01/10/2007 · 01:37 PM #30

I don`t see how BTC`s would amplify the problem. They have always given the person who collects them either through the gifts or by digging for them, the advantage on slower servers. And since the reducting in build pr will increase as the amount of building increases, it will even out the advantage of BTC`s over non BTC`s. Something that has always kinda been a thorn in the side of slower servers.

O Omegian

01/10/2007 · 01:09 PM #29

Note: Artifacts can also unbalance this to a degree on a slower TB server than on RT. But to have the ability to dig and fuse some artifacts in a 1 month time could impose some problems as not everyone is online 24/7 during dig times or even can dig period.

Not trying to make a problem, but that might become a problem for some people who thrive of using btcs by outbuilding people when they know it would hurt most.

ok being given 500 turns out of the blue whenever ste feels happy is unbalanced , but everyone gets it so everyone has that same umbalance , as for digging every day artifacts , this is perfectly balanced. even if someone uses 250 historia on you on slow , thats your problem they all put the effort into making them and targetting you with them , its a valid tactic , although you did just get hardcore bullied / smashed up and hell its really lame and rather unfair but well , its valid and balanced ^^

Edited by Maraudian on 2007-10-02

H Hiigarans

01/10/2007 · 11:17 AM #28

nerfe the capiital build hurt the 3 races much but not Viral. Viral sitll have the build rate advantage. somehow, slower server affect more than expected. UW will be harder to be taken down when its fed allies clear the pr ranking.

before nerfe capital, Collective yell that other race can outrun the pr very fast and then get a big pr quick counter attack after 5 mins of an attack. ok, they get the build rate boost to balance out. so, now when capital build rate was nerfed, Collective build rate still remained but not nerfe as well? lmao, i remember someone told me that nerfe capital will have less work than boost smaller ships, but he still failed to see the chain effect of nerfe. i think it still have alot work to do LOL

when other go down, Collective remained which means that it build rate is higher now. on other sides, Guardian build rate was high now, soon someone will yell Guardian use big pr quick counter like what Collective complain just now.

dont tell me Guardian is easy to kill. u just have to asnwer this: can u win a coutner attack from a Guardian with its classic spam, more than +250% pr and careful attack? when a race can outrun pr easily from u, u gonna expect an instant counter very soon.

IMO, build the smaller ship build rate is still a good choice to balance the stacking. Viral still can RE thier lovely capital ships while smaller ships still can kill them easily after the build rate boost. even if Viral RE smaller ship, it will be a pain for them to know how hard the ship upkeep for other race and learn the stacking way.

the problems on boost would be: how much should boost to smaller ships AND some ships with mult dmg like D class. Colelctive dont need to boost as they arelady had it

smaller ships are not getting boosted , collective build rate is still less than half other race`s , whats wrong hiig did one beat you up or something because you seem to have sour grudge against collective all of a sudden even though they are the most turn hadicapped race in the game * goes to have a look *

Edited by Maraudian on 2007-10-01

B basian_[S]

01/10/2007 · 08:35 AM #27

You are wrong when you think that people are only countering spams with spams.

The idea of multi stack fights is a complex thing to consider. There are many differant combinations of just "good" ships to balance out. Thus people who talk about beating a spam with 1-2 of the counter ships. It is much easier to behindyze something in a much simpler context.

IMO the only thing that is effected by a reduction in capital ship build rates are the high pr climbs. On turnbased servers this puts a cap (more or less) onto the amount of pr someone can use (ideally base this off a no BTC pr jump). And on RT it will cause a change in economy since people will no longer be power building the same. Since it will take more turns to get to high prs spamming ships, people will spend more money to get there. So people will either blow through credits to be a high pr empire, or the prs will drop down. Should increase the effectiveness of the KZ or UW for eliminating credits.

7 7ofborg

01/10/2007 · 07:28 AM #26

so essentially you people whop defend spamming by saying spamming can be countered by spamming some other unit want everyone to resort to spamming ? sure thats an easy but very boring solution. spamming makes for a very dull game

O Omegian

01/10/2007 · 05:20 AM #25

sorry, maru i forgot to mention btcs, since i can never dig and use them ... My fault i guess im at a disadvantage for not being able to dig or fuse.

D DrunkenMasters

01/10/2007 · 01:05 AM #24

Spamming is a tactic. You can`t say how people must fight.

C CounterCrazy

01/10/2007 · 12:22 AM #23

Viral & Guard still have the build rate advanages...

but i dont care about the build rates change... its just the upkeep difference that bug me...

Mara is that idea of black listing spammers still in mind cause if that is set up a mail system for that lol... who cares spamming will never stop im afraid...

lol blacklisting spammers is so sexy an idea ^^ , but im not blacklisting myself :(

Edited by Maraudian on 2007-10-01

S species382

30/09/2007 · 11:08 PM #22

i already recognize a slight increase in stacking, or to be more precise the learning of it, its not often to see the emp in upper stack position used by a year old empire....

T ThEpAkIsTaNIeMpIrE

30/09/2007 · 08:54 PM #21

well the build rates are fine actually they are good but slower the game if u had to do that u should also increase the max limit for turns if not its perfect i think its fine but it does promote spamming spams cannot be stopped

for some random reason stephen recently did increase turn storage , for example it used to be 20 unpaid 30 paid on RT , now its 30 unpaid and 45 for paid

i did take this change a little into consideration

Edited by Maraudian on 2007-10-01

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