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blahdieblahOP
thread accidently moved
Started by blahdieblah
· 17/10/2011 · 04:02 PM
· 15 replies
· 0 reads
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Ragnarok
"Most GCers are of the general impression that UWs should only be possible after you save resources for years, have an empire age of 1000+, build tons and tons of fodder, and sacrifice a lamb or something after you`ve sold half your left soul to the devil. And I don`t know - are they really wrong here?"
You forgot that they have to be a member of the evil cult. We all know who they are. :)
While there are exceptions (I`m one of them), generally speaking the group that generally attempts and succeeds at UWs the most are in the same social group.
You forgot that they have to be a member of the evil cult. We all know who they are. :)
While there are exceptions (I`m one of them), generally speaking the group that generally attempts and succeeds at UWs the most are in the same social group.
R
Ragnarok
Of course, I didn`t mean to imply that exploring got cheaper turn wise, i was talking about the fighting being cost effective turn wise.
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Ragnarok
Well, really, a nice side effect of this is that fighting or exploring for borders also got a lot cheaper turn wise too (unless of course you`re on an insane server like RT).
Anfit pretty much demonstrated that with enough BTC on your side ready to be formed, it is possible to do an explore UW almost single-handedly without rank support.
It`s also easier to build a balanced fleet, and you know that since people are going to spam it`s going to take out only 1-2 colonies instead of 3 if you just explore. And if high PR people take you down, then that just provides that much more fleet intel for your fedmates even if they don`t have rank control.
BTCs are definitely empowered by these changes, but the empowerment works both ways.
If your fleet can survive the first 28 hours before being based and you budget your turns right, only a concerted historia spam, repeated kho shield spamming and people pressing the refresh button on you can stop you.
Anfit pretty much demonstrated that with enough BTC on your side ready to be formed, it is possible to do an explore UW almost single-handedly without rank support.
It`s also easier to build a balanced fleet, and you know that since people are going to spam it`s going to take out only 1-2 colonies instead of 3 if you just explore. And if high PR people take you down, then that just provides that much more fleet intel for your fedmates even if they don`t have rank control.
BTCs are definitely empowered by these changes, but the empowerment works both ways.
If your fleet can survive the first 28 hours before being based and you budget your turns right, only a concerted historia spam, repeated kho shield spamming and people pressing the refresh button on you can stop you.
T
Thief
Well UW is much much harder with faster build rates.. at least we know the game wont go out with someone uwing every 4 days
Future UW fleets will be more fodder heavy, definately agreed.
But I think the main reason his UW failed was because his dummies were weak. Normally....his dummies would have been enough to survive...but with these BR changes, it`s so much easier to take them out.
But I think the main reason his UW failed was because his dummies were weak. Normally....his dummies would have been enough to survive...but with these BR changes, it`s so much easier to take them out.
Future UW fleets will probably be more fodder heavy, as fodder now builds much faster. That makes rebuilding easier too as they are low upkeep. And for fodder UWs you will need bigger dummies to kill whatever is spammed at your fodder, so in that sense a more balanced fleet than a base spam/gall spam should be favorable.
The main reason Blahs UW failed was because the support was non-existing. And exactly in such a situation I think its awesome that it gets smacked down. Before the updates a succes would have been very likely with a 500mil hoko spam on the fast server, no matter how lousy the support was. So now its not only the size of the spam but also the cooperation of the UWing feds that are important, which imo is a step in the right direction.
The main reason Blahs UW failed was because the support was non-existing. And exactly in such a situation I think its awesome that it gets smacked down. Before the updates a succes would have been very likely with a 500mil hoko spam on the fast server, no matter how lousy the support was. So now its not only the size of the spam but also the cooperation of the UWing feds that are important, which imo is a step in the right direction.
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blahdieblahOP
nice post MD, like your humor
yeah I am complaining, but it`s not that I am looking for some compensation. Most people like the new changes and balancing the game, only forget that it greatly changes future UW dynamics.
Saying that easy Hoko spam shouldn`t work. Okay, so balanced stack should. Balanced costs more upkeep on average and more turns to build, which means you need even more credits to be able to build. Furthermore ingame limits are still the same, think about fleetsize/ credits/ minerals.
yeah I am complaining, but it`s not that I am looking for some compensation. Most people like the new changes and balancing the game, only forget that it greatly changes future UW dynamics.
Saying that easy Hoko spam shouldn`t work. Okay, so balanced stack should. Balanced costs more upkeep on average and more turns to build, which means you need even more credits to be able to build. Furthermore ingame limits are still the same, think about fleetsize/ credits/ minerals.
Good luck blah trying to get people, ever to admit that UWs should be easier. (and YES, future UWs just got SHAFTED big time. Increasing the BRs was great for general game balance, but just totally screwed over UW plans)
That is all I will say man, it`s been tried and failed.
Most GCers are of the general impression that UWs should only be possible after you save resources for years, have an empire age of 1000+, build tons and tons of fodder, and sacrifice a lamb or something after you`ve sold half your left soul to the devil. And I don`t know - are they really wrong here?
One thing`s for sure though, your UW was unfairly affected by the changes. Biggest reason being...you didnt know that hoko was going to get so expensive. Otherwise, maybe you wouldn`t have spammed so much. So in that sense...I think you have the right to complain
That is all I will say man, it`s been tried and failed.
Most GCers are of the general impression that UWs should only be possible after you save resources for years, have an empire age of 1000+, build tons and tons of fodder, and sacrifice a lamb or something after you`ve sold half your left soul to the devil. And I don`t know - are they really wrong here?
One thing`s for sure though, your UW was unfairly affected by the changes. Biggest reason being...you didnt know that hoko was going to get so expensive. Otherwise, maybe you wouldn`t have spammed so much. So in that sense...I think you have the right to complain
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Balzac
some thoughts : lately we have seen a lot of UW suceeding in Ultra just because there was not a lot of attacking people (as the PR at what they were made are low), and relying in a spam more than in well thinked fleet.
in Fast , spite the alliances, or the money people have, I think in this last UW , didn`t see active defending UW`er even you take too long to made the necessary changes, tweak it was needed. in my humble opinion it was more a testing UW
in Fast , spite the alliances, or the money people have, I think in this last UW , didn`t see active defending UW`er even you take too long to made the necessary changes, tweak it was needed. in my humble opinion it was more a testing UW
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Ishamael
Uw`s should be difficult. The incentives for winning are too good to make it any easier- considering, for the most part, that all it takes is a skilled alliance and a decent bank account in the first place...
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blahdieblahOP
blahdieblah
83 min(s) ago
UW aftermath
this UW sucked, I already expected a failure rate of 95%. Due to recent buildrate and upkeep changes it became more then twice as hard to succeed the UW. Opposition can almost build twice as fast, btw BTC become way more powerful. Upkeep limits to build a big enough fleet.
I do like all the new changes for normal battles, only not for an UW. To do an UW is already hard, but now even more so. A suggestion would be to half all turn regeneration and max turns, and half STC/BTC effect during an UW.
what do you think?
Blahdieblah
2011-10-17 **This is marked as the right answer**
Maybe not halving turns, but double or more max cap limits. Right now you need a fleet which has to be twice as big. Costs to build that is more then twice since upkeep is not linear.
And please don`t say UW is easy, how many people have been pulling of an UW on fast. This is already a slow game, it took me a year on fast to accumalate enough resources just to be able to build a fleet, most people need even more time.
Blahdieblah
2011-10-17
I prepared months to do an UW. Save credits, fight the ranks, enslave empires, build fleet. And I believe am good in planning, but all these changes screwed up my plans completly.
keltikelti
2011-10-17
the build rate increase actually fixed all the TB server problems with UW`ers spamming 1 ship that was faster turn for turn than some ships that are used for killing it
Sibiriangun
2011-10-17
I strongly disagree. A UW should by all means be very hard to succeed, and imo it has been way to easy to pull it off on TB servers for a long time. Before these updates the controlling feds could just spam hoko and let the UW blow almost without having to be online and do anything.
83 min(s) ago
UW aftermath
this UW sucked, I already expected a failure rate of 95%. Due to recent buildrate and upkeep changes it became more then twice as hard to succeed the UW. Opposition can almost build twice as fast, btw BTC become way more powerful. Upkeep limits to build a big enough fleet.
I do like all the new changes for normal battles, only not for an UW. To do an UW is already hard, but now even more so. A suggestion would be to half all turn regeneration and max turns, and half STC/BTC effect during an UW.
what do you think?
Blahdieblah
2011-10-17 **This is marked as the right answer**
Maybe not halving turns, but double or more max cap limits. Right now you need a fleet which has to be twice as big. Costs to build that is more then twice since upkeep is not linear.
And please don`t say UW is easy, how many people have been pulling of an UW on fast. This is already a slow game, it took me a year on fast to accumalate enough resources just to be able to build a fleet, most people need even more time.
Blahdieblah
2011-10-17
I prepared months to do an UW. Save credits, fight the ranks, enslave empires, build fleet. And I believe am good in planning, but all these changes screwed up my plans completly.
keltikelti
2011-10-17
the build rate increase actually fixed all the TB server problems with UW`ers spamming 1 ship that was faster turn for turn than some ships that are used for killing it
Sibiriangun
2011-10-17
I strongly disagree. A UW should by all means be very hard to succeed, and imo it has been way to easy to pull it off on TB servers for a long time. Before these updates the controlling feds could just spam hoko and let the UW blow almost without having to be online and do anything.
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blahdieblahOP
still wanted to build the other stacks...hoko upkeep got and 25% `bonus`
why would you expect a hoko spam to succeed??
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blahdieblahOP
sorry rag, please forgive me :)
R
Ragnarok
oops :P
And I was just about to finish writing a post. Thanks for wasting 4 minutes of my life blah!! xD
And I was just about to finish writing a post. Thanks for wasting 4 minutes of my life blah!! xD
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